tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-395948500312534280.post8740763863385874172..comments2024-02-25T01:48:45.848-07:00Comments on Mr. Center's Wall: Alice in Wonderland XI -- chapter 8: CALVINBALL or CROQUET?Joseph Centerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00090686611405364311noreply@blogger.comBlogger3125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-395948500312534280.post-51492350396938778212011-02-17T11:23:56.729-07:002011-02-17T11:23:56.729-07:004. Yeah, I think that's it.
12. Yeah, this bec...4. Yeah, I think that's it.<br />12. Yeah, this becomes clear in the next chapter.Jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11708022607046379611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-395948500312534280.post-42267160194474213852011-02-17T08:06:33.874-07:002011-02-17T08:06:33.874-07:00The Big Question: I'm not sure either. I see ...The Big Question: I'm not sure either. I see two possibilities, and either works at this point, though doesn't fit with the original assumption that she would never find it. Either this is NOT the garden, which is possible, as we don't have a detailed description of what she saw through the door, or it is the garden but it's just not as great a place as she hoped it would be.<br /><br />2. The description Carroll gives is different than the image presented by Tenniel. Carroll saws hands and feet come out directly from the four corners of the cards and makes no mention of the their heads....<br /><br />3. The lack of variety is a hopeful crutch for getting away with the crime--for being overlooked. Obviously, as you say, Alice can't participate as there is nothing about her that fits in with the deck.<br /><br />4. To me there's an elevation of Alice above the royalty and cookie-cutter formalities of the court and rest of the deck. The Cheshire Cat is also apart from the rest, not fitting with any of the other characters throughout the adventure, and not fitting with the court. Is sanity just an issue of context, not an absolute?<br /><br />7. The closest thing I've ever found is that this might be a game of bridge. "Looking Glass" of course, as you say is obviously chess, but the moves (most legal, some not) are actually even all delineated. "LG" is also a much more refined piece than "Wonderland." When I reread this chapter yesterday, I also thought about the general power of Queens in cards and can't come up with anything. In my experience, either all face cards are worth the same (like in 21) or they're worth incrementally more moving from Jack up to Ace (like poker). <br /><br />8. I agree.<br /><br />11. I just felt sorry for him. The poor little bunny rabbit that made a potentially fatal class error.<br /><br />12. Well, for one, I don't think anyone's actually getting beheaded. Like you mention earlier, it's about the appearance of following her wishes, not actually following through. With her melodrama and chutzpah, she'll just forget anyway once she's rational enough to go back and check.<br /><br />14. That and they wouldn't have thought to ask the Cat.Joseph Centerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00090686611405364311noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-395948500312534280.post-14181558214573079772011-02-16T15:48:15.304-07:002011-02-16T15:48:15.304-07:00The Big Question: I think that it is. Obviously I...The Big Question: I think that it is. Obviously I can't be sure. One possible thing that I like about the idea is that she could kind of stick her head through the door and look into the garden, and there's an awful lot of beheading in this chapter.<br /><br />1. I think that you could make that case. No one really cares about doing the queen's will, as much as appearing to do it and thus avoiding the consequences.<br />2. Are we assuming that they are just regular cards, or do they have heads?<br />3. The lack of variety is because they presumably are all from the same deck and aren't marked. And Alice could never get as low as the cards even if she did bow.<br />4. It seems to me that only the Cheshire Cat is actually somewhat sane, and he APPEARS (there it is again) to be a grinning lunatic, who acknowledges that everyone there is mad.<br />5. She could have, but with the special emphasis, it seems as though she wants to indict the Queen for not minding HER business and learning to know her subjects. <br />6. I loved your last comment. It is odd how violent this book is at times. I would love to get inside Carroll's head. This scene is just so bizarre. <br />7. I was wondering if any of the stuff you've read about this book mentions whether there is a game in which the Queen trumps or is more powerful than the King that might give rise to this scene. Of course it's the case in chess, but that's not a card game. <br />8. It's almost like he's suggesting that the Queen did not realize the absurdity of her actions. When the more sensible Alice (importantly, I think, a child) points it out, she forgets her rage for a moment.<br />11. Awkward? He thought that she was a worthless servant.<br />12. Yes. Maybe they don't actually have heads to behead. But if they don't, why are they so confounded by the Cheshire Cat having only a face? Of course, that's the opposite problem. <br />14. Again, she's the only one who's slightly sensible.Jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11708022607046379611noreply@blogger.com